Demarra West: From Trauma to Authority — Building a Business on Your Own Terms

Deneen L. Garrett (0:00): Before someone else writes it for you. But what happens when the woman who has spent years giving others a voice finally decides to command the room for herself? Today, we find out. Let's go. Welcome to Women of Color LIVE, the live version of women of color and intimate conversation, a top 20 women's empowerment podcast.

Deneen L. Garrett (0:36): We center and empower women of color. We also have a community for Black women 50, the Dream Lifestyle Collective. Shout out to the production team at the Leon Thomas Group. Today's guest is Damara West, a trauma responsive therapist, well-being steward, social entrepreneur, motivational speaker, author, and founder. She is also a returning guest, having joined us in November 2023 for harnessing power and finding purpose as women of color.

Deneen L. Garrett (1:09): Now this month, we're launching our July series, The Present Series, Command the Room, Own the Narrative. Damara, welcome to Women of Color LIVE.

Damarra West (1:18): Deneen, I am delighted to be back in sacred space with you. We always have a time, and I can't believe that it's been two years, right, at three years nearly, since we were in this space together. So thank you so much for having me. It means a lot.

Deneen L. Garrett (1:35): Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, as we were talking, so much has happened since we last saw each other, which was about two years ago. And so definitely so much has happened since we, you know, first connected, like, three years ago. So just kinda like working backwards, what's the most pivotal thing that has happened since you were on in 2023?

Unknown Speaker (1:55): Oh my gosh. I have to pick one. Right? So many things as we have talked about. But I will say the most pivoted that the most pivotal moment for me has been writing my book, to be really honest.

Damarra West (2:07): My latest book, Love Will Liberate, which took on a life of its own. You know, when I started this journey, I did so under the premise of some of the things that I was seeing in the dating world. Right? The ups and the downs of it. And then I really got to understand through my research, and through the things that I was being drawn to during this period that the book was so much bigger than that.

Damarra West (2:30): It was really about relationships across the board. And it's allowed me to face myself in ways that I've never knew that I needed to face myself. And it's opened me up to being able to love in a very, very profound way, starting with myself and, of course, permeating outwards. And so there's so much more that I can say, but, I'll just leave it at that since I had to pick one, sis.

Deneen L. Garrett (2:51): You're right. You did. You did. I mean, but we can talk a little bit more about that one, but I love that you say, that that's what the book is about, because what we talked about last week, and I've mentioned several times, is that I have a relationship counselor, so she would probably love your book and definitely need to highlight this episode for her. But working through things, whether it's trauma, whatever the situation is, just what's blocking or keeping a person from having a relationship.

Deneen L. Garrett (3:21): Right? Now it's us. It is definitely us. But what about us is keeping us from that? So I'm sure you you dive into to that in your book.

Damarra West (3:29): Absolutely. I love this question because so oftentimes we move through life thinking that people are just coming in and they're harming us. Right? Like, why is this pattern persistent? And any persistent pattern that we have is giving us an opportunity to look at ourselves because, you know, the first time that somebody does us harm, it's on them.

Damarra West (3:48): The second time, it's on both of us, essentially. And so what gets in the way essentially is non secure attachment and trauma. So our first sense of who we are comes through our caregivers. So the ability to know thyself, the ability to understand that we are lovable, that we're funny, that our voice matters. All of these things come from our caregivers.

Damarra West (4:12): So even if we didn't come from trauma, essentially, let's say that you grew up in a household where even, like, financial resources were plentiful, but you weren't able to share what your emotions were, right? You were silenced in the midst of those emotions. Then you're going to tell yourself subconsciously that your needs and your wants don't matter. And so what happens is, is that individuals that are that were once children, right, they become adults and whatever we don't face, we can't heal. So many of us are walking around with these emotional wounds, right, that either cause us to feel like we have to be on an island, right?

Damarra West (4:50): We can't get too close to people.

Unknown Speaker (4:52): Yeah.

Damarra West (4:52): Or we are so wide open that we allow everything to come in, which puts us in a position to be susceptible to harm, right? And so I do believe that people can help us to be the pathway by which that we love ourselves. But I think that the most sustainable pathway and what the research shows is that starting with loving ourselves and curating practices around this is the reservoir by which that we can attract the kind of love that we're worthy of. And there's so much more that the book explores related to that. But attachment styles is the baseline for this.

Unknown Speaker (5:26): Oh my god. Girl, listen. I had never heard about that, but she had me do the little test on attachment styles and I'm like, I don't agree with that. Come on. Maybe.

Deneen L. Garrett (5:41): Maybe. Okay. So those who are watching, we want you to engage with us. We want you to get in those comments, ask questions, drop comments, put WOC so we know you out there, put Dreamer if you're part of the Dream Lifestyle Collective. And we actually have a question.

Deneen L. Garrett (5:58): So someone did ask a question, off of LinkedIn, but I'll come back to the question. I wanna go here. Damara, you spent twenty five years facilitating change in others. But your memoir, Me Too, A Therapist's Journey to Heal, Find Liberation, and Joy is about the change you have to

Damarra West (6:16): make in yourself. When did you realize that your healing and your business were the same journey? Yeah. I appreciate this question because I've been a therapist for about seventeen years now and have spent my entire life pouring into the embedment of the community in a lot of different ways and really believed and that even this desire to become a therapist, I wasn't aware that it was being driven in part by my lived experience with complex childhood trauma. I really thought it was about the fascination around people's behaviors and what drives them to do what they do.

Damarra West (6:53): And so as I poured myself into my purpose and motherhood and becoming a wife and a volunteer in community and a founder and all of these things. If you looked at me on the surface and if you would ask me, I would have said that I was well, that life was good. Right? Why wouldn't my life be good? People were looking at my life and wanting my life in a lot of ways.

Damarra West (7:17): Right. And not that it wasn't good, but there were ways that I realized very late in life, in my late thirties, to be exact, that I had residuals of trauma that were manifesting in lots of ways. So I was aware of some of those ways very early on in my marriage. But a lot of those things didn't come to the surface until much later. And so even my attachment to my work, my sense of self that was rooted in my work, which is something that I can control, much like my academic success, right?

Damarra West (7:48): It was the one of the few things that I could control as an adolescent. As I poured myself into my work, I realized there was so much of life that was actually imbalanced. Right. And I was having a conversation with my ex husband more recently, and he asked me about something I remembered, like, did I remember this moment? And I felt really guilty that I did not remember this moment because first and foremost, trauma like hijacks our memories in general.

Damarra West (8:17): And then when we're spending our lives being busy and investing in all of these things outside of our home life, right, and we're distracted by these things, not knowing the distraction is rooted in this lived experience of trauma, it prevents us from being present with ourselves, present with people that we love. And so I don't live my life that way anymore. But I miss so much of my life because I didn't realize how much trauma was in the driver's seat. And I could talk about lots of other ways, that I realized that, there was a reckoning that had to happen in order for me to rise more into the person that I was always created to be, which far exceeded my education, being a therapist, my community activism, all of that. But who was I at the core stripped away when all of these things were cast aside?

Damarra West (9:08): And so that's the journey that I went on and and came out of that and and still working, right, to to face myself every single day. Yeah. And so and maybe you can give us

Deneen L. Garrett (9:17): a little more in this next question. So as a trauma responsive therapist who has also lived through complex trauma, which you you're sharing with us right now, how does that lived experience shape the way you lead your business and show up for the people you serve?

Damarra West (9:32): Yeah. I mean, I'll tell you. When I became a consultant, I was working for a nonprofit housing organization, and there was someone facilitating a strategic plan for us. And I and I looked at them and I said, oh my god, I could totally do what they do, and I feel like I could do it better. I know that sounds probably really right.

Damarra West (9:49): But I was like, I feel like I could do it better than than they could do it. And I set out on this journey to provide capacity building support to clients who otherwise wouldn't be able to access my services. That desire to remove barriers to be in service of the world was very much rooted in my journey as a complex childhood trauma survivor, in addition to the fact that I grew up in poverty. So, you know, I really and I was seeing the landscape within the nonprofit industrial complex, if you will. Right?

Damarra West (10:22): And all the ways that we are oftentimes not centered. Oftentimes, we are under resourced. Oftentimes, we are under mentored. Right? All of these things.

Damarra West (10:32): And I wanted to be able to contribute to the to the problem. So for eighteen years as a social entrepreneur, I provided market rate on down to fully financially accessible services, right? Pro bono for eighteen years. This is how I run my business. Somebody said to me, it blows their mind that I've that this has worked for me.

Damarra West (10:51): Right? I did not want the business. But I would say that but also how I center my work. Right? I was just speaking at a on a panel about reentry.

Damarra West (11:03): And what does a person need as they re enter society? And I'm like, well, their needs aren't actually a lot different from the needs of general like the general population, right? They may need more support because they've lived in isolation because prison is a micro culture, if you will, much like the military is, right? But really what people need, they need to know, can you help them? Do you care enough about me that you're going to ride along with me, provide sacred space for me?

Damarra West (11:32): Will you be able to see me? Right? Will you be able to see me so that we can co create whatever change that you need in respect of to your life? So I believe that my lived experience as a survivor has taught me that people actually have great strength, great resiliency, great resolutions for their life if only they're given a sacred space to bring those things to fruition. And so I really see my role as a collaborator with the people.

Damarra West (11:59): And so I really believe that we shouldn't be building anything for people without people being a part of the building of a thing, right? So all of those things I know in part were shaped for my early experiences as a survivor.

Deneen L. Garrett (12:12): Yeah. And you know what? And what you just said, experience that the same thing in I mean, that applies in so many different spaces, right? Even like in corporate, thinking back to how they were always creating something for somebody and not even asking that somebody what they wanted. Like, who does that?

Deneen L. Garrett (12:29): Yes. You know what I'm saying? Always doing something without representation. And, you know, I'm like, no, we need and I'm one for let's talk to the people. I'm working in this particular community.

Deneen L. Garrett (12:40): I need to hear from that community. What do y'all want? You know what I'm saying? Yeah. I may have my ideas, but if I'm not from that community, of that community, I really don't know.

Deneen L. Garrett (12:49): Need to hear from you. Do you need? What do you want?

Damarra West (12:53): Yeah. And I'll say I wanna share something really quickly. Years ago, I went through a touch points training, to get certified in it's an early childhood framework that's about helping parents to be deeply connected to their children. Right? And as I went through this process of training, a story was shared about this dad who had lost his wife.

Damarra West (13:17): And through the process of losing his wife, he was left with six children. And they asked him and they came at him and said, we need to give you all of these supports. Like these are the things that we're gonna give you in order to transform your life. And the man said, woah, woah, woah, wait a minute. Really all I need is for you to pay for this dental work so I can go and find another wife that will help me to raise these children.

Damarra West (13:40): This was a real story, right? So what we think people need is not oftentimes what people need. Right. And if if we will listen to the people and then meet them where they are, a lot of the ills of the world, we would not actually see individuals, of course, need to be able to provide a pathway towards healing and liberation And systems, of course, as we know, need to change too. But both of those things need to be happening in tandem.

Damarra West (14:07): Absolutely. And so, you know, as

Deneen L. Garrett (14:09): I mentioned earlier, the series is the present series. And so a person asked a question, Asim Naeem on LinkedIn, he wants to know how can leaders strengthen presence every day?

Damarra West (14:21): This is such an important question. And the way that we strengthen presence every day is by making sure that we are creating space for the human touches that are essential when it comes to creating influence. Right. And not influence for influence sake, but the work necessary that is about investing in people. And one of the things that I tell leaders often and I've been a, you know, a therapist for many years, I've been a certified professional coach for many years, is to give your power away as much as possible, move slow to fast.

Damarra West (15:00): So any kind of change process that we have to roll out, right, giving our people an opportunity to be engaged in the conversation, to process what that change is going to look like, to be a part of the solutions associated with that change and in irrespective to what they can do. But then also simply at a baseline level, just taking time to get to know our people and to be with our people. And it's really about leading with our hearts essentially. And as somebody who is a taskmaster, and let me tell you, I am a type A, I've had to work very hard not to be in a type A space, right?

Unknown Speaker (15:40): Yeah, because I know you wanna flip this around and start asking me questions. I know girl, I know. Listen, listen, okay. And

Damarra West (15:48): so the way that I counter my type A is that I have to pause a lot, right? So instead of going right into the action because I'm doing the action because I want to do good in the world for the people. But if we move too quickly, then it leaves the humanness behind that actually creates the kind of influence and followership that is unparalleled to position. Right? And we want to be able to lead in a way that people can see our humanity so that they too can show their humanity.

Damarra West (16:17): So even being able to say, and times, I don't know the answer to something or I'm really upset about this thing too. Or you know, I'm like, this is what's going on in the world right now and this is what's showing up for me. How is it showing up for you? And I'm not saying to the detriment of the word but if we move too quickly and we bypass the ills of the world both in our individual lives and also what's happening in the external world, then we miss an opportunity to also be as productive as we can be. Right?

Damarra West (16:44): A part of this, the human case is also the business case, right? So I'm sure we could have a whole episode on this since.

Deneen L. Garrett (16:50): Well, we could because you know what? So two I wanna tap in on two areas. One, when I led teams, I would do what's called getting to know you. So I would do a one on one with each person. I'd share some things about myself professionally, personally, you know, encouraging them, modeling for them to do the same.

Deneen L. Garrett (17:07): And that gave me an opportunity to learn more about them, what motivate them, what drove them, right? And then I would tap into that on a daily basis because the work that they were doing was work that was really just paying a check. It wasn't work that, oh my God, I wake up and I jump for joy to go do this thing. It wasn't that type of work. Right?

Deneen L. Garrett (17:25): So I needed to learn what drove them and then find ways to bring more of that into the workspace and remind them on those days when they're like, oh my god, I just can't. No, girl, you can't. Because remember, look at that vision board that we did that's right in front of you. Right? Another one, oh my god, I lost it.

Unknown Speaker (17:50): Oh, it was so good.

Damarra West (17:51): It's gonna come back. What I'll do action with this is that as a leader, a lot of your time should be invested in your people. Yes. And so oftentimes leaders aren't leading. Right?

Damarra West (18:05): And part of presence is showing up. Right? Keeping the time commitments, being fully present, not jumping right into the task at hand, but spending a little bit of time with that relational aspect. So I just wanted to add that to all of the wisdom that you were imparting that simply investing in your people on an ongoing basis is one of the ways that you can create presence as well.

Deneen L. Garrett (18:29): Absolutely. And then that's leadership. That's what leadership looks like versus managing. Yes. Come on.

Unknown Speaker (18:34): So many people are managers. They're not leaders.

Unknown Speaker (18:37): Mhmm. Big difference. Big difference. We might have to do a whole show just on that, queen.

Deneen L. Garrett (18:42): Right? Exactly. Alright. So for the woman who has been holding everyone else together, the clients, the community, the family, what does it look like to finally build something that is fully and unapologetically hers? And hold that thought.

Deneen L. Garrett (18:57): We'll be back after this break. I've been doing this work for a while, building credentialing, showing up week after week for women of color, and more recently for black women 50 who deserve a seat at every table in every room. And I want you to know the rooms are getting bigger. This year, I walked into the Black Enterprise Women of Power Summit as Credential Press. I was accepted as press in the room at the Milligan Institute Global Conference, one of the most prestigious gatherings of global leaders on the planet.

Deneen L. Garrett (19:29): I was also honored as a leadership in action honoree at Career Master. And I finished in the top five in my category in the National Entrepreneur of Impact Competition. And I'm not waiting for permission to be in the room. I'm building my way into every one of them. And the next phase, already in motion.

Deneen L. Garrett (19:50): DreamCon is confirmed, and I'm going with the intention of interviewing my dream podcast guest. Who do you think it is? Drop it in the comments. And we're still waiting on Roots Picnic, BET Cultures, Biggest Week, and Essence Festival. Credential Press at the Marquee Cultural Events of twenty twenty six, bringing those conversations directly back to you across my social channels.

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Deneen L. Garrett (21:08): Welcome back to women of color live. We are talking presence healing and building a business on your own terms with Demara West. So before the break, Demara asked, what does it look like to finally build something fully unapologize yours? Yeah. What does that look like?

Damarra West (21:27): Yes. I love that. And your, video that was displayed prior to us jumping back in on break, prior us jumping back into the conversation, I think is such a beautiful display of what it looks like and giving ourselves permission to be all that we were curated to be. You I have a friend of mine who oftentimes says, Tamara, why do you take off your crown when you go into certain spaces? And I carry that with me now like a badge of honor, because what I know to be true is, is that it does no service to me and to other people for me not to be in the fullness of my power, for me not to wear my crown, for me to deprive myself from building the thing that we know that we've always wanted to build and maybe even have not had the courage to say it or admit it to ourselves.

Damarra West (22:24): Right? So part of what we do is we to recondition ourselves to see ourselves the way that creator sees us. Right. And it's about the stripping away of all the ideas that we've taken on from the world, all the lies that have become our truths that have prevented us from living our life courageously, fearlessly, and with a sense of conviction that this is who we are and it's okay, right? And not only is it okay, it's the right thing for me to be exactly who I am and for me to curate this thing that I know that I was put on this earth to curate.

Damarra West (23:08): And and part of that starts, of course, with just the knowledge that it's supposed to be. It's important for us to do it for ourselves. But at the after it's all said and done, it's also really important for the light that we're meant to share with the world. So, you know, this whole idea that, you know, you put your oxygen mask on first before you're in service of others. You know, I I understand the rationale behind that, alright?

Damarra West (23:32): We can't give from, you know, a cup that is, you know, not full. But but I don't think that's the right argument. I think the right argument is really about first and foremost, we deserve to be well. And if I am well, as a result of making this bold move, because purpose and passion is actually the second highest vibrational emotion that exists. So by virtue of you standing in your power, you getting access into rooms, all of this, this is connected to why in part you've been put on this planet.

Damarra West (24:05): Right. And as we do that, that in itself gives us strength, for us to live a life that is as fully as it can be. But we have to be willing first to curate it for ourselves. And no amount of money and a lot of times it's like we're waiting for the right opportunity, the right timing, the right person, the right but the reality is is that we don't have to wait on anybody. If we have convictions about something that we have are supposed to do in this world, we can be rest assured that as we do it, as we put one foot in front of the other universe source, God creator is going to create the pathway for us to do it.

Damarra West (24:39): Right. But we have to first say yes to ourselves, regardless of the number of times that we said no or the number of times that people said that we weren't capable of doing a thing.

Deneen L. Garrett (24:51): Absolutely. And so what I wanna pull out from that because I definitely am one that says put your mask on first, but I love your ad. Make sure you're well. Make sure you're taken care of. Make sure you're, you know, as whole as you can be.

Deneen L. Garrett (25:03): So that's something that I wanna start adding to when I say that. Right? So make sure you're together. You're good. And it's still that's all part of putting your mask on first.

Deneen L. Garrett (25:12): Right? Because Yes. You you do take the time for yourself. You do find out what it is that drives me, what it is that I want, start working and walking towards that, making sure that you're having your time with yourself, self care, self love, pampering, all the things for your wholeness, your wellness, and then you can help somebody else. And doing all those things for yourself is helping someone else.

Deneen L. Garrett (25:39): It's giving them permission to do those same exact things for themselves.

Damarra West (25:43): And it allows us to not give from a place of resentment, right? Yes. Allows us to give from a place of joy. And the reason why, of course, and I wanna just preface this, oxygen mask, you know, depiction, it can be problematic because if we're telling people to only be well so that we can get to other people, that's actually not the right message. Like be well so that you can because you deserve well, right?

Damarra West (26:11): Of course, like because we were put on this earth to take our well-being and permeate it outwards to the world. We're not supposed to keep it here. We're supposed to take it here. And the way that we do that in the most sustainable way is constantly centering our own well-being so that we can give from abundance.

Deneen L. Garrett (26:31): Absolutely. Get out of the mindset that you're being selfish. If you wanna call it selfish, whatever, that's fine, but it's about taking care of you. So it's it's changing, reframing that language. Yeah.

Damarra West (26:43): Sensing yourself for your wellness. And and and and it really boggles me that we have come to like, somehow we have taken on this ideology, as you have said, that it's selfish. Like what is selfish about caring for ourselves? What's selfish about picking up a book and reading it? What's selfish about grounding outside, taking in nature?

Damarra West (27:06): What's selfish about this? Like, I really want us to like unpack this because at the end of the day, we've got to debunk some of this old ways of thinking in order for us to just do what we were naturally created to do. And some of what we were naturally created to do is to care for ourselves. Right? That's our natural state.

Unknown Speaker (27:28): Now who said I have to come and take care of you when I'm dying? You know what I'm saying? I'm on my last leg, but I gotta come take care of you first. Absolutely not. We're both about to die.

Unknown Speaker (27:40): Come on now. And yet this is what we do, right? As we both

Unknown Speaker (27:44): This is what we do.

Damarra West (27:45): Particularly as women, we oftentimes set ourselves on fire. We oftentimes cast our feelings aside so that we can be more palpable, right, to people. Right? We can be the best daughter, the best wife, the best partner, the best volunteer, you know, the best community service member, the best, you know, person at church that certain like all of these things that I think at the end of the day, don't these things matter, but they actually don't matter. They're not more important than self.

Damarra West (28:17): But we can't wait on other people to give us permission to do that. We have to do it for ourselves for as long as we're gonna be here on the planet. Absolutely.

Deneen L. Garrett (28:26): And I love that you said that we don't need to wait on permission from others because that was, like, one of my standard questions. Like, I asked every single episode about what permission, and so many of the women said none. We don't need permission. And so I kinda like, oh, I need to pull that out because we don't need permission. Right?

Deneen L. Garrett (28:42): We don't need to wait for it. We become it. And when you become it, everything rises to meet you. And that's part of the dream lifestyle standard that we talk about and we work towards. So what does building a business on your own terms actually look like in practice, especially for women of color or black women who have been told to specialize to pick one lane to shrink, as you mentioned before?

Damarra West (29:07): Yeah. This is an important question, and I'm gonna I'm gonna answer it a couple of different ways. First and foremost, when we think about the most successful people in the world, right, people that maybe we aspire to be, they do not have one lane. They have multiple lanes. They have multiple ways that they make money.

Damarra West (29:24): They have multiple ways that they have that their impact is made in the world. So we are not meant to have one pathway. Now many of us get stuck in a pathway, even though our natural design is to evolve, right? We can choose not to evolve. We can choose not to heal.

Damarra West (29:42): We can choose not to liberate. But if we're talking about our natural design, it is meant to change, right? Our personalities aren't meant to stay intact. Our thinking is not meant to be the same. We are constantly being invited in to shape shift so that we can keep rising more into ourselves.

Damarra West (30:01): So part of doing the work that we've been called to do in a way that is right for us is first identifying, right, what is it that we wanna do in the world? How do we wanna do it in the world? And not necessarily even looking to some of the best practices. I do think it's important for us to read about best practices, what's worked for people, what are the promising practices that are out there. But I also think at the end of the day, when you hear about stories of success and how people got there, it's not always the way that we think that people get there, right?

Damarra West (30:34): And it's not always in these traditional ways. And in fact, some of your most successful people in life have taken a very nontraditional route, right? And done it in a way that felt good for them as they were curating a thing. And so social media is a great example for me. You know, I I we were talking about the fact that I was on Facebook for three years, even though I was told, like, what are you doing getting off of Facebook?

Damarra West (30:57): For me and my own mental health, even I needed to do it. Now I'm getting ready to reengage, right? Because we talked about this. Right. Because I'm in a different stage in my work, and I'm also in a different stage of how I'm willing to show up in the world and what I'm willing to expose the world to irrespective to myself and my life.

Damarra West (31:16): Because even though I've written two books and written about very explicit things in my life, very personal things, There's also a part of me that is deeply private. There's a part of me that wants to keep things very close to my chest. And what I've also realized as a survivor, there's ways that I've been in hiding, right? No one could have told me like you see me on a stage, No one could have said that I was the person in hiding. But in many ways, I've come to terms with that the way that I've moved and the ways that I've wanted to keep my life private is also connected to this hiding part.

Damarra West (31:49): Right. And as I've done my work of healing, it's invited me to show more of myself, but also honoring this value that I still may have around keeping some things close to the chest because the world doesn't need to know everything about who I am. So that's just one example of me deciding for myself, even though the world said this is how it needs to be, right? That I need to disconnect from this until I could come to terms with it on my own terms, if you will, not on somebody else's. Absolutely.

Damarra West (32:20): And that's what's key, right? And that's, you know, something for

Deneen L. Garrett (32:22): us to really think about and honestly reflect on. Yes, like you said, the best practices, sure, read them, hear them from other people, but you need to decide what's best for you at that time, what you have the capacity for, because all that makes a difference. What you share when you're not ready is not gonna hit the same way that it will hit when you are ready.

Unknown Speaker (32:45): Come on.

Deneen L. Garrett (32:46): And it may even have some negative consequences to it. So do it in your time. Don't do it because that person said A lot of times people come and they'll say, Oh yeah, you should do this, you should do that. Okay, thank you for that. Right?

Deneen L. Garrett (33:02): Thank you. And then what we do with that is totally up to us, but don't move because that person said you should. Move because it's what's right with you.

Damarra West (33:11): 100%. And you are a great example of this, Right? Like, when I think about the way you're moving now and you've been at this for a really long time, right? You provided value, to the marketplace for a really long time. And with the fact that you said, listen, I'm about to use my platform to get myself in these spaces.

Damarra West (33:31): Mhmm. Right? That takes real courage. Like, how for you to think that you could be one of the people in the room and then you're one of the people in the room. Right?

Damarra West (33:41): I mean, so I love that when we defy against all odds, what the world says is possible, we actually get to decide in part what's possible for our lives. And through the co creation process, we do our work, spirit does the rest, Right? And so I just I love that because you have such a fresh example of that in your life. About what can happen when we decide that I'm gonna have the courage to go after a thing because this is the thing that I believe that I'm supposed to go after.

Deneen L. Garrett (34:10): Absolutely. And and the one thing that recently just happened for me is when I pitched for it is to get press credentials for an event. When I pitched for it, I got the no. Right? I got a no.

Deneen L. Garrett (34:23): You know, sorry, blah blah blah, whatever. And then I'm like, okay, I sat with that. And then I'm like, wait a minute. I remembered who TF I was. And I emailed the CEO and boom, I'm approved.

Damarra West (34:33): Come on now. Come on now. And I love that you said, I'm not taking this as a no because there was a level of conviction that you had. And I love that remembering part. And I think that so oftentimes through rejection, and we think that rejection is really about us.

Damarra West (34:50): Rejection is about protection. Rejection is about helping us to rise. Rejection is about helping us to remember our power, right? So if we understand that everything in life is actually working for our greatest good, our highest use, that even when a no comes our way, we can turn that thing into a yes if our convictions are so steeply rooted in the very thing that it is that we're working to curate in the world. Right?

Damarra West (35:15): So I just love that you shared that additional piece as encouragement for the listeners that, like, don't get caught up on the no. Right? Because a no is not always a

Deneen L. Garrett (35:24): no forever. Right? It was a no from you. You're just doing your job. You're going by whatever, you know, checklist you have, but it's not a no.

Unknown Speaker (35:36): You know?

Deneen L. Garrett (35:36): And then let me and then with this, I'm gonna write with the same thing. So with the same event, there's, like, a event within the event. Right? And so same thing. You know, I sent over, followed the process, and got back a no.

Deneen L. Garrett (35:49): And so then I'm like, dang, do I wanna reach out to the CEO of something that's within? Right? But then I start getting other information about the main event. And I said, you know what? No.

Deneen L. Garrett (36:03): I'm not. I'm not I'm not gonna push this because with all this additional information that's coming through, I probably need to just stick with the main event. So I'm bringing up to say, you need to be centered with yourself to know what it is that you want to be able to just to decide if I want to pursue this thing or not. Like, you you don't have to pursue all nos because sometimes that no is is is good. That no was meant for your good.

Deneen L. Garrett (36:33): You need to know that and you have to get

Unknown Speaker (36:36): to the place where you know that. Yeah, it reminds me of that Willie Nelson song, You Got to Know When to Hold them, You Got

Unknown Speaker (36:43): to Know When Hold them,

Damarra West (36:45): And because so oftentimes, as we both know, people will tell us what we can and cannot do or what we should and should not be doing. Right? For years, people would say, oh, Jamar, you need to be on the radio. I'm like, that's not that's that sounds great. Like, radio is you know, that's a it's a nice space to be in, but it wasn't a space that I ever felt led to.

Damarra West (37:05): Right? So we have to be careful about the way the world tries to guide us because the world is projecting their stuff onto us too. Absolutely. Right? All the time.

Damarra West (37:15): They don't know that they're doing this. Yeah. But they are. And particularly when we're going places that other people haven't gone either, you know, they want to go those places and they're going to try to stop us from going to the place, For that reason. So we just have to be I love this.

Damarra West (37:31): I love what you said about being anchored in our own truth, right? And having such strong convictions that whether people like us, whether they don't, we're good. We know who we are and we can meander through the world and stay in that power regardless of what is thrown at us in in the midst of just living life.

Deneen L. Garrett (37:50): Absolutely. And so I call that those people or those situations, I call that catch up to the vision, right? And catch up to the vision is when someone sees something for you that you don't see for yourself.

Unknown Speaker (38:01): Yes. Because you haven't gotten there yet.

Deneen L. Garrett (38:03): Right? They've turned the corner. They're already on the next block and you haven't gotten there yet. And it's still up to you. What do you do with that?

Unknown Speaker (38:10): Come on.

Deneen L. Garrett (38:11): You lean into it or you don't. You either like, okay, I appreciate that. Let me save that for later. Or yeah, that's a hard no for me.

Unknown Speaker (38:21): But again, you have to

Deneen L. Garrett (38:23): be anchored in yourself, and that's what we're talking about. That's what we talk about every week. It's about you. It's about you taking that time, pausing, being present, and and tapping into your purpose and your passion, taking the time to figure out what that is because so many people will live an entire life and never know. Yes.

Deneen L. Garrett (38:42): Oh my god. Never know.

Damarra West (38:44): Take it to the grave. So many of us leave this earth not not knowing who we are and not having the courage to and if we know if we have the good fortune of knowing who we are, sometimes just not having the courage to to live out loud. Yeah. So many people, you know, I oftentimes say that when people on their deathbeds, nobody is saying the the money that they wish they would have made, the things that they wish they would have won. Nobody's saying that, right?

Damarra West (39:11): Like our biggest regrets are rooted in the ways that we loved and didn't love. So as we are in the pursuit of the passion, the thing, also being in pursuit of love, right? Love for self, love for the world, because at the end of the day, what are what's more important? What's more important than those things?

Deneen L. Garrett (39:31): I love that. And so now you're taking us kinda back to the book. Right? Yeah. I didn't know.

Unknown Speaker (39:39): Hey, look, we got where we're supposed to be, girl. That's okay. Okay. Good, good, good. So what's the name of the book and tell us a little bit more about it.

Deneen L. Garrett (39:48): And what are you willing to share that has manifested for you as a result of the book?

Damarra West (39:55): Absolutely. So this is this is the book, Love Will Liberate. Love Will Liberate is about how we are hardwired for connection, the and all the science behind it, all the well-being benefits that come from healthy relationships in all forms, what gets in the way, trauma, non secure attachment, and what we can do about it. Based on my research, I created a nine part framework called the love liberation framework, which supports us in finding our people and sustaining those relationships. And so even for existing relationships, there's a chapter called romantic love can be all that it's cracked up to be.

Damarra West (40:33): Right? So even if we have been in lackluster relationships for thirty plus years, right, this chapter could change everything because no matter how long we have been stuck in a thing, the moment that we decide that we don't want to be stuck anymore, we will find all kind of pathways to get us out of that thing. Right. And then there's tons of resources in the book also to help people to discover thyself, for help people to work through conflict as it arises in relationships, to help people to understand their attachment style and how they can manage that particular attachment style. And so the book, you know, it came out at the end of January.

Damarra West (41:15): And again, I as I shared earlier, you know, it took on a life of its own, literally. It is truly a labor of love. And one of my first book, I've never been more proud of anything. My second book, I've never been more excited about anything because I know what this book can do for people. And particularly as the longer we live, the more isolated we're we're becoming.

Damarra West (41:40): Mhmm. Right? And we have really come to many people have written off relationships because of the pain mired by past relationships. Right? And I and I write about this in my book that when people are saying things like, I'll never love again, I never want to get married again.

Damarra West (41:56): I never this is really pain talking, Because what what I know to be true is that all of us actually connection. But what we don't what what we also want is we want harmony. And if we and one of the things that pain can do from relationships is convince us that relationships are actually not worth investing in if this is what comes along with them. Right. The other side of that is, though, that when we do our work and we're able to find the right people who can rock with us, who see us, who love us, who are going to speak truth to us, who want to see us rise, there is nothing like being loved in that way.

Damarra West (42:33): There is nothing starting, of course, with the way that we radically love ourselves. And so this is why I even I advocate for dating ourselves, slowing the process down, looking at patterns within ourselves versus blaming other people and the ways that that other people have harmed us. We also have to take responsibility for the ways that we have participated in that harm, whether we did so unconsciously or not. So the last thing I'll say many things have happened since the book came out. You know, I'm on a national book tour right now.

Damarra West (43:03): And outside of, you know, my my city, the great city of Detroit that we get to talk to that, which there'll be tons of events in Detroit, already things that have happened. And then, you know, about nine cities outside of Detroit. And then, you know, I found love. Hey. And romantic love.

Damarra West (43:24): Right? Because love can happen in our, you know, familiar relationships, in our platonic relationships. And this was somebody that I've known for a really long time. We were like on the outside of each other's lives had barely even paid attention to each other over the last twenty years, no professional settings. And in April, we ended up being in the same space.

Damarra West (43:45): And when we're ready, we're just ready. He was ready. I was ready. And what has happened since then has been a wild, beautiful ride and being able to feel what that what it feels like to be radically loved by someone because I've done the work to radically love myself. I love that.

Damarra West (44:06): Tell us the the title of that chapter again. So the the chapter is called romantic love is romantic love can be all it's cracked up to be.

Deneen L. Garrett (44:17): Yeah. And so I wanna stress that it can be. And I stress that because we have I think sometimes we have a fear of what can happen positively. Because we don't know that. We haven't seen that.

Deneen L. Garrett (44:31): It takes me back, and I say Akila to be, to that poem, right, about your biggest fear is success, and I believe that. I believe that for a lot of us, it's not a fear of failure. Absolutely it is, but I think that there's with some of us is actually that fear of success, that fear of that thing, we don't know that. We don't know, well, how is that gonna change my life when I get that thing? When I have that love, what is that gonna look like?

Deneen L. Garrett (44:57): Now, do I have to be up under them all the time? Like, what in my life has to shift? What has to change? What do I have to give up? And that's why a lot of times we don't follow through on things, whether it's love or anything, right, business, things that we've been talking about, professional career, because we don't wanna put in that work.

Damarra West (45:17): Girl, and I love all of the things that you just said because that is real. You know? I even in this relationship, I had to have some some lots of moments to myself and lots of vulnerable moments. Like, oh my god. We're doing this.

Damarra West (45:30): And, like, oh, you want me to be your girlfriend already? Like, are we moving too fast? Like, all of these things, like, what is how do I make room for you in my life? I've been, like, single for the last eight years predominantly. All of these things that really freaked me out.

Unknown Speaker (45:43): I'm not gonna lie. And then I said, well, Damar, this is what you asked for. Girl, like, this is what you've been preparing yourself for. So all of this stuff that you're worried about, you're gonna figure it out. And the beautiful thing is, is that I I am with someone who allows me to just be and freak out.

Damarra West (46:03): Right? Because I'm going through this and like and like, babe, it's okay. We're gonna work through this. That reassurance and that every time something like that happens, I know this is my person, right, because God sent me exactly what I needed to buffer me.

Unknown Speaker (46:21): Right?

Damarra West (46:21): This is about buffering me and all of these changes that are nearly taking my breath away because it didn't look like I thought it was gonna look, it didn't happen in the time frame I thought it was gonna happen. All of these things and then when it was here, it was like, oh my god, what do I like? What do I do with this? I feel like I'm gonna be really honest. I feel like I'm learning to walk again, how to ride a bike, like all of these things.

Damarra West (46:44): And in many ways, I am. But in many ways, everything that I've done leading up to this point prepared me for this very moment.

Deneen L. Garrett (46:52): I love that. I love that. And I think so Orin and I were on last week, and I think he said something about how, you know, we when we make plans and how God laughs at our plans, I thought of that when you were saying it didn't look the way you thought it would look. We have to get away from there's nothing wrong with having that vision. There's nothing wrong with doing vision boards and putting up the things how you want it to look, and at the same time, be open to how it's supposed to look, how it's supposed to be.

Damarra West (47:23): This is so good because the real magic and you and we know people who have manifested based on that specificity. Let me be really clear. Like, when you hear Viola Davis' story and her husband and how she conjured him, But I don't actually think it typically happens this way. I think that the real there we have control, but then god has control. Like, I always say that we don't get to decide what are the package that our abundance is coming in.

Damarra West (47:52): Even our enemies can actually write checks for us. Even our enemies can open doors for us because we don't actually get to dictate where our blessings are coming from. And so, you know, I had this moment where I said to him, I said, you know, I gotta go back to my 28 list because my sense is that when I go back to this 28 list, you are probably going to meet just about every single point on this list, which has nothing to do with this man's aesthetics. It really had nothing to do whatsoever with aesthetics, with age, with like his background, none of it. And so I talk about relationship visions in the book as a resource, because whether we're talking about friends or lovers or partners, husband, wife, it doesn't matter what it is.

Damarra West (48:39): We get to decide what are the qualities most essential in the relationship, and then we can sit back and wait for that thing to appear. Right. But if we if I had said I want, you know, six foot two football, like all Viola did this, by the did this by

Unknown Speaker (48:56): the way. Only want this. Maybe You know what I got? If a six point one, I don't want.

Damarra West (49:03): Oh, oh, got the nerve to be five, five, eight. Okay. I'm sorry. I did not like, you know, and then we can sit back and wait because if we say too much specificity, we actually might not get some of the things that are most central to who we are and what we need. And so I love that you're inviting us in to be open to all the possibilities based on what is actually most important for us and for feeling the love that we that we deserve.

Damarra West (49:36): Right? So and and some of this stuff that I that he is is actually unscripted. It's not a part of the twenty eight. Right? It's bigger and better than what the '28 was in in many ways.

Damarra West (49:47): And so stay tuned, dot dot dot.

Deneen L. Garrett (49:51): And that goes back to what I was saying as far as when we plan versus God's plan, what the universe has for us is always bigger and better, Right? Because we're we have unlimited. You know? Right? We have limited framework, knowledge, experience, etcetera.

Deneen L. Garrett (50:07): Right? It only fits into what we've actually experienced, whereas God, the universe is infinite. It's it's much bigger and larger. So yes. Yes.

Deneen L. Garrett (50:15): Yes. You mentioned this before. You actually mentioned it before we went live because of the panel that we were on, and you said the word a couple times through the conversation, abundance.

Unknown Speaker (50:27): Yes.

Deneen L. Garrett (50:27): Let's kinda sit with abundance for a moment. What comes up?

Damarra West (50:33): So when I think about what it means to have an abundant life, I think about living life as fully and as unrestricted as possible. I think about joy, right, and both curating joy from the inside out and also making time for joyful experiences. I think about mind, body, spirit and the interconnection of these three worlds and living abundantly means that we're sitting with self enough through practice that these three worlds are constantly in concert with each other. Right? You know, one of the things that I ask for spirit often is help me see what I need to see, help me hear what I need to hear.

Damarra West (51:24): And part of that is really just an invitation always for me to access my higher self. And so part of living abundantly is being able to access higher self. It's about living authentically. It's about making the kind of money that we desire. It's about doing good in the world.

Damarra West (51:44): It's about having joy and having peace and phenomenal relationships and honoring this body for the sacred vessel that it is, right? So abundance for me is really the totality of how we live, who we be, who we are, and how we permeate that out into the world.

Deneen L. Garrett (52:05): I love that, who we be. I love that, who we be. So our last question, what is one step a woman can take today to begin building her business or her life in abundance? Yeah. I mean,

Damarra West (52:20): the first thing that we can do is really analyze the ways in which we are carrying scarcity mindset. And scarcity mindset can be a really tricky thing because every thought that we have, every emotion we emit, every behavior that we act out is all connected to abundance. So I, you know, the school of thought is start with the mind Yeah. And really understanding, are we looking at ourselves in a favorable light? Are we having generous thoughts about ourselves and other people?

Damarra West (52:54): What is our relationship with money? Do we really believe that all of this money is available? What are we going to do with all this money? Should we get it? Because it's not just for us, it's about doing good in the world.

Damarra West (53:06): So I really start with the unpacking and the replacement of scarcity thoughts with abundant ones. I do this. I'm a instructor for the Black Entrepreneur Training Academy in Kalamazoo. As you know, that's my hometown. But I get to call the D like, that's my sitting now, right?

Damarra West (53:27): My heart bleeds for the D. But I'm from Kalamazoo, and I'm still on this training team for the Black Entrepreneur Training Academy. And I kick us off with abundance mindset. Why do we start this thing with abundance mindset versus the mechanics of business versus how you manage your finances versus like what your business structure needs to be? Because what I know to be true, particularly for a lot of black and brown entrepreneurs, right?

Damarra West (53:49): We are carrying around a lot of scarcity, which prevents us from taking the risks necessary to be able to build in the ways that we were designed to build in that courageous way that we talked about in a way that is on our own terms, essentially. And so if we are too focused on money as a pathway, it actually can serve as a blockage. So we have to understand the energy of money. And we have to understand that the energy of money is rooted in the energy of our thoughts. And so if the more that we can think in positive, we'll say positivity.

Damarra West (54:25): The more positive thoughts we have about ourselves, about other people, about money, about what's possible. This is why not focusing on the ills of the world too much. Not focusing on our problems too much. Not focusing on our lack too much. Because if we do those things, it actually lowers our vibration.

Damarra West (54:43): Yeah. And we want to keep our vibration high. And we do that through our thinking. But then the foundation for it is also like being generous. There's certain behavioral principles that come along with living abundantly.

Damarra West (54:56): Right? So if we if we hold on to money too closely, then money is not being used as a way it's regenerative. I just like our thinking should be regenerative, just like our lives should be regenerative. And so I would just start with analyzing what ideas we have about money and then begin to root ourselves in abundance thinking using something simple as like affirmations. Because a simple affirmation has great power to reframe our thinking.

Damarra West (55:27): And if we can reframe our thinking by creating new synopsis, then we naturally begin to orient towards abundance thinking, which, of course, then materializes through financial means and other kinds of means that make our life rich.

Deneen L. Garrett (55:42): Thank you so much. Demara West, thank you so much for for joining us on Women of Color live and coming back. Always a good time. Again, I will link, the initial or the original episode so y'all can check that out as well. Also wanna shout out the Leon Thomas Group for producing us every Thursday at 1PM eastern.

Deneen L. Garrett (56:03): And next week, we'll be back with Danielle Desir Corbett. She is a podcast marketing coach. And those who are in the podcast world, you would know her from Women of Color Podcasting. She started that several years ago. That was like her voice was the only voice that I really was following in a podcast world.

Deneen L. Garrett (56:22): And so next week, we'll be here together. So thank you so much again, D'Amara, and congrats on the love that you've manifested. And see you all next time.